My name is Redlegger and I am an Altaholic. I absolutely love Utah skiing and haven't been to Colorado in 20 years. I was lured into Denver when I payed $650 for 5 round-trip tickets NS from Nashville to Denver Feb 13-17. As I began looking at the rest of the picture I quickly developed Colorado sticker shock. At this point I've snagged a 2 BR condo in the Mountain House area. I'm looking for tips on lift tickets, kids rentals, and maybe cool things to do with 3 kids under 12(8,9,11) keeping value somewhat in mind. Also any skiing tips at Keystone, and if I were to do a daytrip to another place(Vail,Breck,Copper) which one? Was a subscriber to the newsletter for several years, glad I found you guys. Thanks.
Keystone Help
- Thread starter Redlegger
- Start date
Just to clear up any confusion we're not related in any way to the defunct Inside Tracks newsletters, although we have one of their former writers on staff (Tony Crocker). It's a common misconception. In any event, welcome!
I'll let the Colorado folks address your specific questions.
I'll let the Colorado folks address your specific questions.
I can't give you specifics, but you should probably stay in Dillon or Frisco to reduce lodging cost. If you don't want to confine your skiing to Keystone (why should you?) you'll be commuting to ski much of the time anyway.
I would guess you should try to get some kind of a Vail resorts ticket good at Keystone, Breck, Vail, Beaver Creek. If you're on your own every day I'd get a day in at Copper.
I would guess you should try to get some kind of a Vail resorts ticket good at Keystone, Breck, Vail, Beaver Creek. If you're on your own every day I'd get a day in at Copper.
johnnash
New member
We just got back last night from Keystone. We were there last year about the same time (MLK holiday) and the conditions were better then, but I can?t complain. Even bad Colorado conditions beat the hell out of the best conditions we get in the DC area! We didn?t have any significant fresh snow, but the slopes were in pretty good condition, although some were beginning to get a bit icy in patches. But by February, you probably won?t have any problem.
On housing, I?m sure that Tony?s right that you could get it cheaper in town (although we got a 2-bedroom close to the Mountain House for $175/ nt, including tax and cleaning; I doubt you could beat that by very much), but with kids especially, there?s a real convenience factor in being able to come back to the condo for lunch or whenever someone gets tired. But, of course, it all depends on your needs.
From the Mountain House area, my recommendation is to take the Peru lift (Argentine is about the same location, but a lot slower and from the Peru you can watch the terrain park antics while you ride), then ski down to Montezuma lift, which takes you to the top of Dercum Mt. Or if it?s cold and you want to ride the Village gondola, you can ski to the gondola from the top of Peru. There was a bit of a line for the gondola at times (esp. around 10:00), but you can avoid long lift lines at the gondola and Summit Express lift (which are located together), by skiing into the Summit line on the other side of the gondola building (skier?s right). Other than this lift, there were minimal lines, so once we discovered this trick, we spent hardly any time in lift lines, even on a holiday weekend. The North Peak and Outback are especially uncrowded.
Re. good trails, I don?t know what your preferences are, but if you like a fairly steep pitch, but don?t like bumps, try the Go Devil run on the far skier?s left of Dercum Mt. (you have to ski through the A-51 terrain park to get to it) or Beger, closer to the gondola. These are the 2 blacks they seem to keep groomed. Some other blacks were either farily short (Bullet on the North Peak), or not terribly bumpy (Last Hoot on Dercum). If you like long, steep and bumpy blacks, I can?t help you ? those I avoid! For a long blue groomer, you can?t beat Elk Run on the Outback, which also has some nice bumps along the side, so you can combine a bit of mogul practice with a groomer run if you want. Santa Fe on Dercum is another good run to get some mogul practice on a blue, but unlike Elk Run it's all moguls.
Maybe others will correct me, but I?m afraid you won?t find the kind of steep discounts on lift tix that you?re accustomed to getting in Salt Lake City ? at least I haven?t been able to find these. But you can get somewhat discounted tix if you get them before leaving Denver. You can get them at different places, but we stop for groceries and lift tix at the King Sooper just off of I-70 at an exit called Youngfield/ 32nd st., I believe. They have 3 out of 5 day tix for $216, compared to $234 at the window. (If you want to buy in advance, you may be able to get a similar price at the Keystone website, but we prefer not to take the risk of buying in advance.) The same tix are also good at A-basin, Brek, and (one day) at Vail or Beaver Creek, so you can ski around, but we were happy for 3 days to stay at Keystone. We went to Copper in early Dec., and had a blast there, but they?re not part of this deal, so you?d have to buy separate tix if you decide to go there.
If your kids are interested in terrain parks, check out Freda?s incubator park, next to the big A-51 terrain park. It?s got a nice assortment of mellow jumps and small rails.
Happy to answer other specific questions.
On housing, I?m sure that Tony?s right that you could get it cheaper in town (although we got a 2-bedroom close to the Mountain House for $175/ nt, including tax and cleaning; I doubt you could beat that by very much), but with kids especially, there?s a real convenience factor in being able to come back to the condo for lunch or whenever someone gets tired. But, of course, it all depends on your needs.
From the Mountain House area, my recommendation is to take the Peru lift (Argentine is about the same location, but a lot slower and from the Peru you can watch the terrain park antics while you ride), then ski down to Montezuma lift, which takes you to the top of Dercum Mt. Or if it?s cold and you want to ride the Village gondola, you can ski to the gondola from the top of Peru. There was a bit of a line for the gondola at times (esp. around 10:00), but you can avoid long lift lines at the gondola and Summit Express lift (which are located together), by skiing into the Summit line on the other side of the gondola building (skier?s right). Other than this lift, there were minimal lines, so once we discovered this trick, we spent hardly any time in lift lines, even on a holiday weekend. The North Peak and Outback are especially uncrowded.
Re. good trails, I don?t know what your preferences are, but if you like a fairly steep pitch, but don?t like bumps, try the Go Devil run on the far skier?s left of Dercum Mt. (you have to ski through the A-51 terrain park to get to it) or Beger, closer to the gondola. These are the 2 blacks they seem to keep groomed. Some other blacks were either farily short (Bullet on the North Peak), or not terribly bumpy (Last Hoot on Dercum). If you like long, steep and bumpy blacks, I can?t help you ? those I avoid! For a long blue groomer, you can?t beat Elk Run on the Outback, which also has some nice bumps along the side, so you can combine a bit of mogul practice with a groomer run if you want. Santa Fe on Dercum is another good run to get some mogul practice on a blue, but unlike Elk Run it's all moguls.
Maybe others will correct me, but I?m afraid you won?t find the kind of steep discounts on lift tix that you?re accustomed to getting in Salt Lake City ? at least I haven?t been able to find these. But you can get somewhat discounted tix if you get them before leaving Denver. You can get them at different places, but we stop for groceries and lift tix at the King Sooper just off of I-70 at an exit called Youngfield/ 32nd st., I believe. They have 3 out of 5 day tix for $216, compared to $234 at the window. (If you want to buy in advance, you may be able to get a similar price at the Keystone website, but we prefer not to take the risk of buying in advance.) The same tix are also good at A-basin, Brek, and (one day) at Vail or Beaver Creek, so you can ski around, but we were happy for 3 days to stay at Keystone. We went to Copper in early Dec., and had a blast there, but they?re not part of this deal, so you?d have to buy separate tix if you decide to go there.
If your kids are interested in terrain parks, check out Freda?s incubator park, next to the big A-51 terrain park. It?s got a nice assortment of mellow jumps and small rails.
Happy to answer other specific questions.
You should get the supermarket tix John recommended and do one (midweek) day at Vail, one at Breck and the rest at Keystone/A-Basin if that's where you're staying. When I stayed at Keystone I split some days at lunch between Keystone and A-Basin.
As I recall, Starfire along the liftline of the North Peak chair is one of those Gpaul semi-steep long consistent crusiers.
As I recall, Starfire along the liftline of the North Peak chair is one of those Gpaul semi-steep long consistent crusiers.
Thanks for the comments. Glad to know you can truly come home for lunch. Where exactly did you stay at Mountain House? So it's feasible to split time between A-Basin and Keystone in the same day? As far as bumps go, I'm history, had a bone graph in my knee couple of years ago so as much as I hate to give in, I'll be doing more black cruisers and looking for some fresh, and hanging with my kids. If you did a day at Vail, where would you head?
My first trip back after surgery was to Alta in 05. I had dreamed of a garlic Burger and a PBR at Watson's during my rehab, Didn't have the PBR but had those great burgers. They said they were tearing it down. What's become of it?
My first trip back after surgery was to Alta in 05. I had dreamed of a garlic Burger and a PBR at Watson's during my rehab, Didn't have the PBR but had those great burgers. They said they were tearing it down. What's become of it?
johnnash
New member
We stayed at the Hidden River condo -- about a quarter mile from Mountain House, so no problem to walk back to the unit for lunch. I can't comment on Vail -- never been there. I've never been to A-basin, either, but the sign says it's just 5 miles or so up the road from Keystone, so in principle, should be easy to do both in 1 day.
I envy you -- wish I were going back in Feb. Have fun!
I envy you -- wish I were going back in Feb. Have fun!
I've done A-Basin in the morning and then Keystone in the afternoon and evening because Keystone has night skiing. We had planned on doing A-Basin all day but we picked the wrong day it was cold and blowing and a storm hit earlier and heavier than predicted so we left A-Basin at lunch and went back to the condo to warm up. We could walk to the Peru lift from our condo so some of us headed back out for some afternoon and night skiing.
The drive up wasn't too bad to A-Basin wasn't too bad but the drive down with the snow and visibility was a little sketchy for us flatlanders.
Oh yeah, the fun thing about A-Basin and with the snow coming down we were able to ski to the car!
The drive up wasn't too bad to A-Basin wasn't too bad but the drive down with the snow and visibility was a little sketchy for us flatlanders.
Oh yeah, the fun thing about A-Basin and with the snow coming down we were able to ski to the car!
yak
New member
Redlegger":2inw9cdq said:
You can find great cruising just about anywhere on Vail. You want to avoid some areas at peak times such as Mid-Vail and Chair 5 (High Noon). Poppyfields is a nice fast blue groomer right down the middle of China Bowl.
On the front side, there the famous Riva Ridge for death-defying cruising, Highline and Blue Ox are good when they're groomed, although they lead to the slower chair 10. Safari and Bwana down to Lionshead are never crowded in the afternoon.
For a powder perspective, (and trying to keep it easy on your knee) the same runs are out-of-body experiences with some fresh on them. Most of the back bowls will get bumped up after some fresh, so while you'll find areas that are relatively smooth, they usually lead to bumped up chutes before you reach the catwalks. Anywhere in the bowls is nice for fresh. Try hiking Ptarmigan Ridge (7-10 minutes up a cat track)for some smooth fresh above the bowl.
The Beav is a groomers paradise, and typically less crowded than Vail.
Larkspur gets the morning sun and is always buffed. Centennial is another great cruiser on the main mt. And any of the birds of prey runs are killer when they're rolled.
I would visit both. I believe a multi day pass allows you one day at each. PM me if you have more questions, I've probably got close to 100 days at Vail over the years.
Prima-Pronto is groomed now? That was one of the classic steep bump runs anywhere, comparable to Gunbarrel at Heavenly or Spiral Stairs at Telluride. joegm would sabotage a snowcat in protest.
Redlegger":1zclbwx9 said:
Modern, so it lacks the retro charm and historical value of the old structure. At the same time, it also lacks the old Shelter's cramped quarters, musty smell, and dingy lighting.
The Watson cafeteria is on the 2nd and half of the 3rd floors. Collins Grill occupies the remainder of the third floor, while restrooms, a logo wear shop, and the Baldy Brews coffeehouse are on the 1st floor. The footprint is the same as that of the old structure, but it's on the opposite side of Main Street (or Mambo, or whatever it's called at that point).
yak
New member
Tony Crocker":1bo6hqd8 said:
D'oh! As I pondered it, I realized that I was thinking of Riva Ridge, not P/P. Last time I skiied it, my legs were screaming near the bottom so I stopped for a break where Trans-Montain crosses it (which also crosses Prima). If I hadn't stopped, I would have been launched at warp speed into the ungroomed volkswagen field below that was unseen from above. :shock:
Yes. As I recall Pronto drops off to skier's right of Prima and gets steeper after you've already skied several hundred verts of moguls.
A must-ski run for joegm, Dan DePiro etc.
A must-ski run for joegm, Dan DePiro etc.
ChrisC
Well-known member
Tony Crocker":2t9txecg said:
Telluride destroyed Spiral Stairs a long time ago - around 1990. RIP.
In order to make the mountain more palatable, the Lower Stairs was cleared of all its tree islands, widened and groomed daily. People almost think of it as part of the Plunge. And the lower, lower part of Spiral Stairs was renamed Jaws.
What made it really unique (1972-90) was its views spilling into the town of Telluride, super steepness, multiple tree islands causing you to 'pick' a different stair for every headwall (hence "Spiral Stairs"), a massive 3000+ vert and --- until chairs 8/9 installed in 1986 -- a required 4 slow lift rides for access. Hence, the bumps were soft, powdery and uncrowded.
The top headwall is the only thing left.
For bumpers, a combo of Kant M'Kam, Spiral, Lower Plunge and Mineshaft (or whatever they are calling it) is the route.
Red - Spiral Stairs
Green - bumpers lap
Adam skied Spiral Stairs in 1992 at age 7. Since he was so small and on 100cm skis, he really liked bumps then. The bumps were so tight in East Drain on that trip that I couldn't keep up with him.
CO_knuckle_dragger
New member
Keystone is my favorite resort in CO. It is definitely the place to be when its windy and/or cold. Also, the back bowls of Keystone do not have lift access and thus get a lot less traffic than similiar terrain at Copper, Breck, Vail, BC, etc. The hiking is totally worth it.
Flying Dutchman is my favorite blue groomer anywhere though I generally try to stay away from Dercum Mountain. North Peak and Outback are usually a lot less crowded and you are less likely to encounter people who have no idea what they are doing.
Someone mentioned StarFire on North Peak. Great run, but be careful. It gets really icy in the afternoon and is somewhat notorious for killing people. I myself ended up being a first responder for a Texan who lost a fight with a tree on that run.
Another run to be careful on is Schoolmarm, which is a very long green that winds its way down Dercum. It is generally full of people who don't know how to ski and didn't bother to take a lesson.
Best cheap Apres Ski is to combine the drink specials at Parrot Eyes and the pizza at First Run. They are right next to each other on the main drag in Keystone.
If you are interested in saving some money and bending the rules a little, PM me as there are easy ways to do this at Keystone.
Flying Dutchman is my favorite blue groomer anywhere though I generally try to stay away from Dercum Mountain. North Peak and Outback are usually a lot less crowded and you are less likely to encounter people who have no idea what they are doing.
Someone mentioned StarFire on North Peak. Great run, but be careful. It gets really icy in the afternoon and is somewhat notorious for killing people. I myself ended up being a first responder for a Texan who lost a fight with a tree on that run.
Another run to be careful on is Schoolmarm, which is a very long green that winds its way down Dercum. It is generally full of people who don't know how to ski and didn't bother to take a lesson.
Best cheap Apres Ski is to combine the drink specials at Parrot Eyes and the pizza at First Run. They are right next to each other on the main drag in Keystone.
If you are interested in saving some money and bending the rules a little, PM me as there are easy ways to do this at Keystone.