Mt. Baldy, CA 1/26/08

Tony Crocker

Administrator
Staff member
Today was the first time since 2005 there's been enough snow for me to go to Baldy. It may be a short window if tonight's storm rains to 8,000 feet as predicted yesterday. But it didn't start raining in LA until 7PM, so maybe we'll get lucky and it will come in a bit colder.

Today was the usual mix of positive and negative surprises. It was fortunate we arrived early, as Chair 1 was loaded at only half capacity, so people who showed up at 8:30 probably took well over an hour to get on the hill. The beginner chair 2 was slow and stopped several times, so when we wanted to ski chair 1 we took the Fire Road all the way to the Notch to avoid the big line on 2.

It was a tough day for the road too. We beat the morning problems, but did not escape a mess at the end. We left the ski area parking lot at 4:30 but did not get past Mt. Baldy village until 6:25.

Nonetheless the ski day was well worth the hassles. Friday was cloudy so nothing melted and refroze. There was sun this morning so the chair 4 runs softened. Baldy's patrol observed the same avalanche potential Friday we've been reading about at Mt. High, so people were not allowed to ski down chair 1 then and thus we got the first shot at it today. I suspect the same was true for South Bowl, as we got 4 good powder runs in there before 11AM.

With the bottlenecks getting on the hill Thunder's line never got over 10 minutes. Adam came up from San Diego with Molly, who is on UCSD's ski team. She's from South Tahoe and unfortunately blew out her ACL at Christmas. But she's skiing with a brace and will have the reconstruction surgery in spring. At 11:30 we moved to Chair 1 and skied the widely spaced trees between Nightmare and Morgan's. Snow was not as soft as South Bowl, but still smooth and consistent.

The storm left its usual wind-plastered rime on trees, lift towers, etc. And there were strange places with bad coverage, like some lower sections of Bonanza and Robins. While cover is not yet comparable to our last big years of 1998, 2001 and 2005, nearly all of the steep lines were navigable today.

At 12:30 Adam and Molly had to leave, but I then met up with Ben Solish. Adam and Ben have skied together in the Snowbird group since 1996, and both of them are going with me to Canada next week. Ben and I took our chances with the sun exposed runs. Holcumac faces directly south and ends up under chair 1. It was OK where untracked, but quite heavy and probably an hour past its prime. But the next run down the SW exposure to the back of the parking lot was timed perfectly. It had this strange Baldy combination of powder and corn, which I think is produced by the initial softening of an originally windpacked surface.

After 2PM the clouds and fog rolled in, not climbing up the Notch as usual, but coming from the SE backside of Thunder. I skied a few more runs there, then Morgan's down to the bottom. 19,900 vertical, 7K of varied powder.

Editorial comment to admin 5/12/2012: The "place inline" feature now makes it easy to put pictures in the correct order. Unfortunately every report done the old way now has pictures in reverse order. Easy to fix one report, but it's taking the better part of 2 days to fix 4 years of reports.

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When it's clear Baldy's scenery is impressive. I believe it has the largest lift served "vertical view," top of chairs at 8,600 to sea level, in North America. Of course that 8,600 might not crack the top 50 in the Alps.
 
I went up yesterday as well, what a beautiful day. I happended to get to the top of thunder right as they droped the rope to south bowl... definatly the run of the day. Lets keep the snow coming!
 
Last night's storm did come in with the predicted high snow level but was not as strong as expected. After a break this morning the next storm started this afternoon and the areas are reporting snow. Garry will be at Baldy tomorrow, so I should get an informative report.
 
Tony Crocker":3jmfza0p said:
Today was the first time since 2005 there's been enough snow for me to go to Baldy.

I am interested in Baldy. However, unlike Mad River or Magic Mountain - these places do not have 2 year gaps in their skiable periods. Maybe a bad year is 2 weekends, but 2 years?

Also, why cannot they seem to get there lifts functioning properly? It seems a little ridiculous. I understand that snowmaking and water wars are very difficult. I understand they are one of the closest reasonable sized mountains located near a vast population. Is there no solution to this conundrum?

Nice to see a good ski day in LA.
 
I do not see much of a solution to Baldy's issues. In my chart http://bestsnow.net/scalhist.htm you can assume that Mt. Baldy was never fully open in a season with no weekends rated "A". That's 11 out of 32. In this situation you must keep overhead low (very small permanent staff) and under no circumstances take on debt.

So there is no budget to upgrade lifts, and when they get big storms they are relying on part-timers to get things open and running. The road situation is better than 20 years ago; it seems to get plowed every day necessary. There are still unexpected surprises, like the half capacity uploading of chair 1, which I never saw in 2004-05. I have seen half capacity downloading at the end of the day several times though.

So the casual skier who gives Mt. Baldy a try last Saturday has the following experience:
1) They see how close it is on a map and head up at 8:30, encountering the first traffic jam.
2) Then it takes over an hour to get on the hill going through a ticket line with 2 windows and the slow-moving chair 1.
3) If they are renting gear or taking lessons, that's another line up at the Notch.
4) Probably 30 minute line for lunch at normal hours.
5) 3 groomed runs on Thunder, 2 of which are constricted at the bottom by sections with low cover. One groomed run on chair 4, which by the way didn't open until nearly 11AM.
6) Download chair 1 in late afternoon fog or ski the marked intermediate run under the lift with hard snow, unmarked rocks and lots of congestion from people beyond their ability level.
7) Then the almost 2 hour traffic jam at the end of the day to get just the 4 miles down to Mt. Baldy village.

This doesn't sound much like the report I wrote above, does it? How many of these people are coming back? I think we know the answer to that question from 2004-05, when Mt. Baldy opened October 29 and closed May 22. My friend Garry Klassen skied 86 days at Baldy that season, but season skier visits totalled only 50,000. Compare to 500,000 at Mt. High and probably at least 700,000 at Big Bear.

Baldy does have some snowmaking, but those of us who like to ski there aren't going to come unless we can ski the steeps and the trees. This is why I wish Mt. Waterman luck but believe it must be run on the same minimalist low-cost model to survive. Waterman gets a bit more snow in good years but has the same total wipeouts in bad years. It is all north facing, but it's less than 1/4 the size of Baldy. Mad River is considered a success, but the recent SKIING magazine piece indicated it is living closer to the edge of financial viability than many of us had assumed.

Mt. Baldy has the permits to develop its north facing backside and even a new base facility and easier road up Lytle Creek. But all of this would take millions of $ from an equity investor/ski benefactor.

On a positive note, last night's storm was at least 18 inches and should have buried any rain crust from Saturday night. With even average weather the rest of the season I'd expect a couple of months of decent skiing at Baldy and a SoCal score of at least 30 for the year. But I will be in town only one of the next 6 weekends.
 
Tony Crocker":1d5urcym said:
1) They see how close it is on a map and head up at 8:30, encountering the first traffic jam.
2) Then it takes over an hour to get on the hill going through a ticket line with 2 windows and the slow-moving chair 1.
3) If they are renting gear or taking lessons, that's another line up at the Notch.
4) Probably 30 minute line for lunch at normal hours.
5) 3 groomed runs on Thunder, 2 of which are constricted at the bottom by sections with low cover. One groomed run on chair 4, which by the way didn't open until nearly 11AM.
6) Download chair 1 in late afternoon fog or ski the marked intermediate run under the lift with hard snow, unmarked rocks and lots of congestion from people beyond their ability level.
7) Then the almost 2 hour traffic jam at the end of the day to get just the 4 miles down to Mt. Baldy village.

Thanks to reading your TR's and website over the past couple years, I was able to avoid all of these factors on my first powder day at baldy. Just wanted to thank you for your advice, as i owed my great day to it.
 
seems to me that we've had a few threads already on the nature of Mt. Baldy and why it does/doesn't work for Los Angelenos.

I was a transplanted Mad River Shareholder living in Sherman Oaks, and I was absolutely thrilled to discover Baldy. I now live in NJ and would kill to have such a great ski hill less than an hour drive away!


My best memories of days at Baldy are enshrined here
 
I still believe the Baldy/Mad River analogy is apt in terms of overall scale and challenge of terrain, plus the old lifts/lower density vs. more modern areas. Baldy is daytrip to the population centers and thus easier to cherry-pick, but Mad River's greater consistency surely produces more usable ski days over the long run.

This is why I keep ragging on the easterners about depending upon their local areas for consistent skiing throughout the season. Baldy is an extreme example of the same issue.
 
Tony Crocker":10699jet said:
I still believe the Baldy/Mad River analogy is apt in terms of overall scale and challenge of terrain, plus the old lifts/lower density vs. more modern areas. Baldy is daytrip to the population centers and thus easier to cherry-pick, but Mad River's greater consistency surely produces more usable ski days over the long run.

This is why I keep ragging on the easterners about depending upon their local areas for consistent skiing throughout the season. Baldy is an extreme example of the same issue.

50K in a great year yet all those traffic horror stories? Is the snowplayer situation as bad there as it is along Hwy 2 near Mountain High?
 
On Saturday afternoon at about 3:30 PM, there was a solid line of parked cars on both sides of the road from the Baldy parking lot to down below Mt. Baldy village, more than 5 miles down. These were probably all snow players, as the skiers/boarders probably parked in the lot (since someone was collecting $5 from non-skiers/boarders trying to park in the lot).
 
SoCal Rider":375om1h2 said:
50K in a great year yet all those traffic horror stories? Is the snowplayer situation as bad there as it is along Hwy 2 near Mountain High?

when i left baldy at 2:45 on Saturdy the traffic coming up baldy road was already backed up all the way to nearly the freeway exits: all of this caused by people trying to park for snowplay. (and the accident that occured in the tunnel in the morning probably didnt help)
 
Is the snowplayer situation as bad there as it is along Hwy 2 near Mountain High?
Worse IMHO, because those hairpins are much more treacherous and likely to cause an accident blocking the road. On Jan. 6, 1989 I didn't get out of the parking lot until 10PM. Yes, the skiing was worth it that time too.

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Even without any crashes the uphill afternoon traffic can tend to be horrendous. Ya know how they build toll booths at bridges and turnpikes? The road might be two lanes but of course it needs to be many more lanes near the booths, or the flow would gridlock. Everybody understands this...except the Forest Service with their Adventure Pass. They stop every car, and think the gridlock only extends barely around the corner -- not miles and miles.

And they keep doing this even after there's no place left to snowplay/park! Of course having now paid to park, the snowplayers begin to park in lanes. The truth is stranger than fiction.

We're from the government. We're here to help...
 
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