Western Weather 2017-18 and Later

[Tony Crocker]

Some of the best areas are the beneficiaries of storm flow blow-in snow, resulting in about 150% of reported.

This is routine on the upper steeps at Mammoth, which is why I got to ski several of them on Oct. 29 in 2021. At Mammoth the wind during storms can come from either NW or SW, which makes a big difference in where the most blow-in snow is.

 

[ChrisC]

My brother checked out the newly opened Black Iron Bowl/Mountain Quail yesterday …. Said not bad. Also view into Revelation.

Hopefully winter finally starts….

 

[Tony Crocker]

One week into January that 57% of western average snowfall from Dec. 31 is up to 61%. That should increase even more next week.

 

[jamesdeluxe]

A quick update below from Bryan at Solitude. If I recall, a majority of SLCers are against a 3S gondola in LCC. Gotta wonder if they were reconsidering their opinion while stuck in that mess.


We're finally getting some good snow. Alta was great on Friday but the drive down the canyon was over 3.5 hours!! No accident. We idled and rolled, car length by car length.

Solitude is getting quite a bit less than LCC but I think the crowds today were much more reasonable from what I've heard.

 

[ChrisC]

Yesterday, my brother and some Telluride friends decided to powder chase to Wolf Creek. The snow bands stayed south of Telluride, so they decided to travel south. Wolf Creek received about 30 reported inches, but he said it loaded deeper. Waist deep in places. Again, you had to stay steep or get stuck. And staying steep at Wolf Creek can be challenging.

There first 'big day' of the season. Said it took about 3.5 hours each way. I'll get some photos.

 

[jamesdeluxe]

There first 'big day' of the season. Said it took about 3.5 hours each way.

I'm trying to imagine that -- being based at Telluride and needing to drive 3.5 hours to ski powder.

 

[ChrisC]

I'm trying to imagine that -- being based at Telluride and needing to drive 3.5 hours to ski powder.

Telluride received about 4-5" from the same storm. They just wanted to ski some really deep snow - 30"+. I'm not sure my brother has been to Wolf Creek in 5+ years.

Sometimes, locals will also make road trips to Little Cottonwood (Snowbird, Alta), Crested Butte, or Aspen. It's always 'follow the snow.'

Finally, you must do shopping/errands in Montrose, Durango, or Grand Junction. I am sure they stopped by something on the way home.

 

[jasoncapecod]

A quick update below from Bryan at Solitude. If I recall, a majority of SLCers are against a 3S gondola in LCC. Gotta wonder if they were reconsidering their opinion while stuck in that mess.


We're finally getting some good snow. Alta was great on Friday but the drive down the canyon was over 3.5 hours!! No accident. We idled and rolled, car length by car length.

Solitude is getting quite a bit less than LCC but I think the crowds today were much more reasonable from what I've heard.

This is really no different than leaving a major sporting or concert event. At the end it could take you three hours to get out of the Meadowlands parking lot. People get greedy and stay to the end get there early leave early simple solution.

 

[EMSC]

This is really no different than leaving a major sporting or concert event. At the end it could take you three hours to get out of the Meadowlands parking lot. People get greedy and stay to the end get there early leave early simple solution.

This doesn't really work at a certain point.

I70 used to be easy to time shift for going early and leaving the resorts early once upon a time. Now I70 can easily be backed up from 5:30a till almost noon going up and gets backed up by ~1p all the way till at least 7-8pm on the way home. I'm not aware of many people that are interested in leaving home earlier than 4 am and leaving the ski areas by noon to time shift by that much. Once you do that is it even worth going or enjoyable as a day any more? Get crud leftovers for the day by leaving home at 11a and skiing at best 12:30-4p? Etc...

Same thing is now happening to the SLC areas as that metro builds up population (and specifically way more non-LDS). Time shifting probably worked just fine up till a couple years ago for LCC and BCC (been over a decade since simple time shifting worked here in Colo). It's not like "hey lets leave at 2:30-3p" works anymore. They need to at least try something new IMHO (as does Colo too).

 

[ChrisC]

Same thing is now happening to the SLC areas as that metro builds up population (and specifically way more non-LDS). Time shifting probably worked just fine up till a couple years ago for LCC and BCC (been over a decade since simple time shifting worked here in Colo). It's not like "hey lets leave at 2:30-3p" works anymore. They need to at least try something new IMHO (as does Colo too).

You can add Northern California to the mix. We have the usual ski traffic utilizing I-80 and US 50 at all hours except very late. When younger, we occasionally would not leave the Bay Area until 8/9pm to get to Tahoe at 12/1am.

You also need to factor in suburb/exurban sprawl from Sacramento. It extends along I80 and US50 from downtown Sacramento to Auburn or Placerville for almost 40 miles. So if recreational ski traffic does not get you, normal commuter traffic will.

 

[EMSC]

It extends along I80 and US50 from downtown Sacramento to Auburn or Placerville

I haven't been in the Placerville/Sacramento areas in a long time. Placerville used to be a fairly small place, well separated from any craziness or any other towns. Used to have friends in Placerville that I'd visit from S Tahoe when I worked/Lived in Tahoe (early 90's). Crazy to hear that it is now considered an exurb of Sacramento!

 

[ChrisC]

I haven't been in the Placerville/Sacramento areas in a long time. Placerville used to be a fairly small place, well separated from any craziness or any other towns. Used to have friends in Placerville that I'd visit from S Tahoe when I worked/Lived in Tahoe (early 90's). Crazy to hear that it is now considered an exurb of Sacramento!

Well, I go by when traffic starts to ebb and flow. Or maybe the location of the last In-N-Out Burger. Possibly the exurbs end at Shingle Springs on US-50. But you can be in downtown Sacramento from Placerville in under an hour in good conditions.

 

[Tony Crocker]

Thankfully the L.A. to Mammoth drive remains much easier than when I first skied there in 1978 due to there being only 25 miles of two-lane vs. 125 then. Unfortunately the drive from Orange County, San Diego, Inland Empire via Cajon Pass has become much worse. Adam says Cajon Pass itself has become like ChrisC describes I80 and US50 with traffic at many odd hours. Past Cajon Pass, US395 now has 20 miles of high desert exurbs with lots of traffic lights. And the 80 miles beyond that to the junction with the 14 is still nearly all two-lane.

 

[tseeb]

Palisades opened KT-22 today for the first time this season and had a major avalanche under the top of the chair. One fatality and one injury were reported.

 

[EMSC]

Palisades opened KT-22 today for the first time this season and had a major avalanche under the top of the chair. One fatality and one injury were reported.

Yikes and sad to hear. I'm sure similar to Taos a couple years ago that there will be plenty of second guessing on opening of new terrain. Somehow held up for Patrol bombing and sign/rope placement, etc... but within 30 minutes of opening to the public it went... Wonder how much wind loading from the current storm happened overnight on that slope though...

I'm worried that it's going to be a bad Avalanche season nearly all around. Enough snow on the ground to form facets during a month of nearly no snow will now be hair trigger layer for Avi's the rest of the season in most regions.

 

[ChrisC]

Palisades opened KT-22 today for the first time this season and had a major avalanche under the top of the chair. One fatality and one injury were reported.

That's terrible news. Thoughts and prayers to the family.

Sounds like the entire bowl slid. Usually, the Sierra snowpack is relatively stable.

 

[Tony Crocker]

Usually, the Sierra snowpack is relatively stable.

Yes, in terms of not having weak layers release weeks or months later. But right after snowfalls, I vaguely recall from the Westwide data 1979-1995 that Palisades had the record of most avalanches observed in a month, something like 700? Wind loading is the nemesis at areas like Palisades and Mammoth. I suspect patrol bombed it, but I guess you never know for sure.

In the month after I retired (October 2010) I attended the International Snow Science Workshop hosted at the Resort at Squaw Creek. I'm sure this avalanche will be a hot topic at the next meeting, even though it's in Norway.

The third and final day of the meeting is devoted to avalanche case studies. I recall the Saddle Peak avalanche of 2/16/2010 at Bridger Bowl being a featured topic at Squaw Creek. I also recall the Revelstoke snowmobile avalanche of March 2010 being discussed, though the ISSW paper on it is from 2012.

ISSW meetings are usually in late September/early October, attended mainly by ski patrols, guides, academics and a handful of interested amateurs like myself. Sites:

2024 Tromso, Norway

2023 Bend, OR

Fernie 2020 postponed, then cancelled

2018 Innsbruck, Austria

2016 Breckenridge, CO

2014 Banff, Alberta

2013 Grenoble, France

2012 Anchorage, AK

2010 Squaw Valley, CA

2009 Davos, GR, Switzerland

2008 Whistler, BC

2006 Telluride, CO

2004 Jackson, WY

2002 Penticton, BC

2000 Big Sky, MT

1998 Sunriver, OR

1996 Banff, Alberta

1994 Snowbird, UT

1992 Breckenridge, CO

1990 Big Fork, MT

1988 Whistler, BC

1986 Lake Tahoe, CA

1984 Aspen, CO

1982 Bozeman, MT

1980 Vancouver, BC

1976 Banff, Alberta

 

[Skieric]

There is a very interesting documentary “Buried” on Netflix regarding the tragic 1982 Avalanche at Alpine Meadow's. It was an enormous slide that buried the lodge , parking lot and access road. Apparently the entire alpine meadows terrain is all avalanche paths.

 

[ChrisC]

There is a very interesting documentary “Buried” on Netflix regarding the tragic 1982 Avalanche at Alpine Meadow's. It was an enormous slide that buried the lodge , parking lot and access road. Apparently the entire alpine meadows terrain is all avalanche paths.

Yes, well done documentary. The north side of Alpine Meadows is very steep and pure avalanche country. I remember watching TV coverage of the search for survivors and recovering a woman after five days.

I thought this was a new film, but it came out in May 2021, premiering at Telluride's Mountainfilm Festival and winning the Audience Award. My brother saw it then and was like - Chris, the film is old news.

I wish the streamers would show some Warren Miller or TGR films.

 

[EMSC]

I remember watching TV coverage of the search for survivors and recovering a woman after five days.

I wish the streamers would show some Warren Miller or TGR films.

I also recall it being huge national news on the TV for days.

Warren Miller is part of the Outside magazine group now. You can pay to rent or buy some titles on Amazon Prime for streaming. But the full collection is only part of "Outside +" which I can't believe virtually anyone pays for. Probably can't get the price they prefer from the main streaming players being niche content.