Alta, UT 1/30-31/2016

Tony Crocker":13xez0pb said:
China is investing considerably in renewables and has had a leading role in the price reduction of solar panels. They are not doing this because Obama asked them to do it. They are doing it because they realize they have serious environmental problems.
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Nonsense. They're doing it because they know that there's money to be made.
 
Admin":vq9qr3g4 said:
Nonsense. They're doing it because they know that there's money to be made.
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???? Let's see... According to admin, the US is wasting money subsidizing unprofitable technologies but the Chinese are investing in these same technologies because they make money??? :-k :-k :-k
 
Apples and oranges. Solar technology is not yet at the point where it's profitable to operate when compared with fossil fuels. However, as the Chinese have proven, it can be very profitable to manufacture and sell the equipment - especially with sweatshop labor.
 
Marc_C":1rk4iz19 said:
Admin":1rk4iz19 said:
Solar technology is not yet at the point where it's profitable to operate when compared with fossil fuels.
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Are you talking exclusively about photovoltaic cell technology or all forms of solar tech?
http://www.theverge.com/2016/2/5/10923000/morocco-biggest-solar-power-plant-sahara

There's a similar installation in the Mohave Desert outside of L.A.
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But how much does it cost to create one KWh? That was my point. The link you provided speaks nothing to that. And besides, that's in the Moroccan desert. Just like the Mojave, there are few places in the world that receive that kind of dependable solar radiation, and even if we could afford financially and environmentally to plaster every inch of the Mojave with solar panels, it still wouldn't eliminate America's need for non-renewables.
 
Admin":30c4dpmb said:
..., it still wouldn't eliminate America's need for non-renewables.
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Who ever said this was a zero-sum game, requiring 100% replacement of one source with another?

Some quick research shows that currently conventional non-renewable power in the US costs between $0.05 - $0.39 per kWh, with the average at $0.12. Worst case solar, with no tax subsidies or rebates, is around $0.22 with most installations coming in at $0.12. The current estimates are that by 2020 solar will drop to an average of $0.09.
 
MarcC":e3kpwceu said:
Are you talking exclusively about photovoltaic cell technology or all forms of solar tech?
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My impression from Adam (whose Master's thesis was on solar thermal) is that photovoltaic is cheaper than solar thermal at the moment. And most of the photovoltaic is being produced where it's being used, not needing transmission lines from remote desert areas.

admin":e3kpwceu said:
Just like the Mojave, there are few places in the world that receive that kind of dependable solar radiation
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The American Southwest is a location where dependable solar radiation is quite close to major population centers.
MarcC":e3kpwceu said:
Who ever said this was a zero-sum game, requiring 100% replacement of one source with another?
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Which is why the American Southwest seems a reasonable place to develop these technologies. As opposed to Maine (missing Mt. Abrams thread) :lol: .
 
Maybe, maybe not. Which would be fine if were Mars we were studying and not living in the same ecosystem that we are significantly altering, likely irreversibly.
 
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