Park City and Deer Valley look miserable over the holidays

We went to Park City today. We bought the one day passes for myself and Kylie only months ago for the sole purpose of just checking out the mountain. We always planned to let the kids check out the town and Outlets at Kimball Junction while we skied.
As expected it was crowded and there was not much open and the lift lines averaged 5 to 10 minutes with some wait times much longer. (See below). There was some snow overnight though so the surfaces were nice and the clear weather in the afternoon allowed us to take in some views and get a sense of what the place is about. And we had a longer than usual lunch.
Kylie made the observation that most of the happy looking people on the mountain and in the villages were not hard core skiers. They were there for a winter experience. We saw plenty of smiling faces and many people done up in fancy clothes (and a midriff top which is a first in a ski resort for us) that seemed to be delighted to be buying $8 coffees and $17 hot dogs.
As a side note we noticed a much higher percentage of rental ski equipment than we have noticed at the other mountains which indicates Kylie’s theory about the punters being tourists and not serious skiers is probably right.

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^Patrollers in picket lines on the road side.

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^The lifts at the choke points were kinda busy.😂

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^Proof we’ve been there. Our first and highly likely only visit. I think that gets me to 78 ski hills.
 

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That Miners Camp lodge in your photo is always quite a busy place on big days at Park City. I have quite a few days at Park City, but IIRC the last was in 2020. Since then I've kind of stuck to Ikon. It's a huge place and fun to explore in good conditions and moderate crowds.
 
I think that gets me to 78 ski hills.
Probably more impressive from Brisbane than 200+ from well situated Euros or Americans.

So I get the lure of adding new areas to the list. But I have standards, and visiting a 20% open area isn't really experiencing it. As I noted before, that has happened to me in the Alps with weather closures, most recently at Aletsch Arena.

Too bad former admin wasn't around to give you that Alta local's tour instead.

Hopefully you explored the town of Park City some, many excellent dining options. It's the main reason so many skiers go there as it's the only true ski resort town in Utah. Presumably kingslug preferred to retire there rather in the Salt Lake Valley.
 
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Too bad former admin wasn't around to give you that Alta local's tour instead.
We have accommodation in Mill Creek anytime but I hope to get to experience Little Cottonwood Canyon at prime time in the next couple of seasons. @jimk is a fixture all season and you’re around first week of March?
 
But I have standards, and visiting a 20% open area isn't really experiencing it.
Agreed.

Hopefully you explored the town of Park City some,
We have visited the town without skiing before. It’s got a nice traditional vibe. It doesn’t top the ‘posh with an undertone of grunge’ feel of Aspen though in my humble opinion.
I would like to experience Telluride at some point as even the images ooze character.
 
The discussion of feeder resorts and how to invest in and operate them is moved here.

Back on topic, Alta reports 20 inches new snow and the storm is not done. BCC is up to 62% open, while LCC obviously has to keep all avalanche exposed terrain closed. But it's safe to say both LCC and BCC are set for close to full operation soon. Snowbasin is 83% open. Park City at 29% still has a long way to go.
 
It had not occurred to me that Park City's terrain limits were due to anything other than lack of snow. As noted before, 2017-18 and 2020-21 were even more limited during the holidays. But now season snowfall is 86 inches (Summit House estimate = 80% of Jupiter Peak reported) and it's still 29% open today. In 2018 Park City's season snowfall as of Jan. 31 was 74 inches but it was 60% open. In 2021 Park City's season snowfall as of Jan. 31 was 87 inches but it was 77% open. So yes there are valid grounds for suspicion considering that Snowbasin has expanded from 32% open Dec. 24 to 83% yesterday.

FYI in 2018 and 2021 Park City was 28% and 41% open Jan. 15, underscoring what a poor choice it is for early season commitments. Here's the history for Park City during the holidays, mediocre at best for western destinations:


2024-25
21%
2023-24
40%
2022-23
93%
2021-22
41%
2020-21
18%
2019-20
77%
2018-19
66%
2017-18
15%
2016-17
89%
2015-16
76%
2014-15
56%
2013-14
74%
2012-13
79%
2011-12
43%
2010-11
95%
2009-10
75%
2008-09
77%
2007-08
92%
2006-07
86%
2005-06
97%
2004-05
97%
2003-04
99%
2002-03
50%
2001-02
100%
2000-01
90%
1999-2000
40%
1998-99
40%
Average
68%
Median
76%
75th percentile
91%
25th percentile
42%

I critique the slow openings of terrain in Colorado, but only Loveland, A-Basin and Crested Butte have worse records for the holidays than Park City.
 
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The fact that tombstone lift is closed is a pretty clear indication that its not a lack of snow.
As well as the entire dreamcatcher area.
 

Data reveals Park City Mountain’s open terrain hits seven-year low during strike

Similar to Tony's analysis of what should be open with current snowfall. This implies that the ski patrol strike is impacting Pak City's operations.

Combined with the previous lawsuit preventing Park City from installing 8-pack and 6-pack HS Lifts, I think Park City wins the award for most dysfunctional ski resort and ski town.

LINK

TownLift

TownLift
Jan 3, 2025

Park City Mountain base area at 11:00 a.m. on Sunday Dec. 29

Park City Mountain base area at 11:00 a.m. on Sunday Dec. 29 Photo: Park City Mountain Webcam

Historical data reveals that with a 42" average snow pack for last week, 34 lifts and 177 trails (50% of the mountain) should have been planned to open, compared to just 18% actually available.​

 
The article compares 7 years but using base depths not always from the same location.

The table I posted above also has some apples-and-oranges. Before 2015-16 I describe it as "Park City group," which combined SnoCountry trail counts from Deer Valley as well as Park City and probably the Canyons as a separate area. From 2015-16 onward my stats are consistent: Snowfall is Jupiter Bowl x 80%, percent open is also direct from Park City website. So, season percent open and snowfall as of Dec. 31:


2024-25
21%
70
2023-24
40%
61
2022-23
93%
163
2021-22
41%
76
2020-21
18%
54
2019-20
77%
85
2018-19
66%
52
2017-18
15%
45
2016-17
89%
89
2015-16
76%
103

Today is 30% open on 87 inches snowfall.
 
Park City ski patrol strike made the Today Show today. They are asking for $23/hr which is what friend's college grad son gets for taking and calling orders at In-N-Out in East part of SF Bay.
 
Park City ski patrol strike made the Today Show today. They are asking for $23/hr which is what friend's college grad son gets for taking and calling orders at In-N-Out in East part of SF Bay.

They (Vail Resorts) do not want this to be a base wage for anyone.

But I have sooo many stupid Nurse Practioner/Physician Assistant friends who earn 10k+/mo doing almost nothing. They think they are bright, but their MCAT scores are scarily low, hence no med school. Yeah, right - you have a 3.0 average and are a mess. Most are lacking. I do not allow any NP/PA to diagnose me. Specifically, they annoy me as much as influencers - because they think they are doctors.

Yes, ski patrol can help - a lot - and deserve a semi-living wage. Do you really want to do $20/hr on the scene first?
 
At a ski area you can’t avoid ski patrol being first on the scene of an on hill accident. Hopefully they should have similar emergency medical trading as firefighters, ambulance drivers, but I know in the case of Liz at Mt. High they may not. They were not even allowed to give her Advil!

Obviously ski patrol requires more skills than flipping burgers; why does Vail think they should be paid similarly?
 
They (Vail Resorts) do not want this to be a base wage for anyone.

But I have sooo many stupid Nurse Practioner/Physician Assistant friends who earn 10k+/mo doing almost nothing. They think they are bright, but their MCAT scores are scarily low, hence no med school. Yeah, right - you have a 3.0 average and are a mess. Most are lacking. I do not allow any NP/PA to diagnose me. Specifically, they annoy me as much as influencers - because they think they are doctors.

Yes, ski patrol can help - a lot - and deserve a semi-living wage. Do you really want to do $20/hr on the scene first?has p
Totally agree here, Chris. But, at least for me, it is getting harder and harder to see my "doctor" (you know, the person who went to an accredited medical school in the USA and passed the various exams to have the letters "M.D." after their name). Now, if I am feeling sick or think I may need medical care on a short-term basis, I can almost NEVER see my regular doctor but rather are given the option of seeing one of the P.A.'s who works in the primary care practice. Nothing personal against the PA's, but, in many cases, I think I know just as much as they do, just from watching YouTube videos or going to the Mayo Clinic website.
 
I actually should look at my paycheck from Dartmouth Skiway for Ski Patrol.
.
I think I was at least making $15/hr in the 90s in NH.

This $20/hr stuff is BS…. Every item in a skki town is at least 3-4x now.

I don't want to take this to Trump stuff, but I really, really believe Park Ciiy ski patrollers should get paid $20++++ if not $30+ you have to have a lot of life/death training…..and smart rescuers??!!! You NEED then!

I just cannot connect a sport I love, and zero care for Ski Patrol, ….. You don't need a DEI initiative….. But get your mountains in order!

$300+++lift tickets??!!! I think its tipping point.
 
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I actually should look at my paycheck from Dartmouth Skiway for Ski Patrol.
.
I think I was at least making $15/hr in the 90s in NH.

This $20/hr stuff is BS…. Every item in a skki town is at least 3-4x now.

I don't want to take this to Trump stuff, but I really, really believe Park Ciiy ski patrollers should get paid $20++++ if not $30+ you have to have a lot of life/death training…..and smart rescuers??!!! You NEED then!

I just cannot connect a sport I love, and zero care for Ski Patrol, ….. You don't need a DEI initiative….. But get your mountains in order!

$300+++lift tickets??!!! I think its tipping point.
I ain't paying $300 a day to ski ANYWHERE! Heck, I would say $200 (or even lower) is the tipping point for me and, I would assume, many other skiers. Obviously, though, a ploy by the big ski area owners to get people to pony up the money at the beginning of the season for one of the super passes - Epic, Ikon, etc.

Although, if you compare it to golf, for example, many of the top golf courses that allow the "public" to play (Pebble Beach, Pinehurst No. 2, etc) are now well over $500 to play a single round - about 4 to 5 hours of golf. So, maybe being able to ski at JH, Aspen, Vail, etc. for a 7-hour day for $200 to $300 a day is not that out of the realm.
 
I ain't paying $300 a day to ski ANYWHERE! Heck, I would say $200 (or even lower) is the tipping point for me and, I would assume, many other skiers. Obviously, though, a ploy by the big ski area owners to get people to pony up the money at the beginning of the season for one of the super passes - Epic, Ikon, etc.

Although, if you compare it to golf, for example, many of the top golf courses that allow the "public" to play (Pebble Beach, Pinehurst No. 2, etc) are now well over $500 to play a single round - about 4 to 5 hours of golf. So, maybe being able to ski at JH, Aspen, Vail, etc. for a 7-hour day for $200 to $300 a day is not that out of the realm.
I play a fair amount of golf in the summer in Virginia, usually at a very affordable nine-hole muni two miles from my house for $14 per nine. But about 10 times a year I will play with friends at full 18 hole courses. Some of my friends play in a seniors league and I pinch hit with them when one of their regulars can't make it. They get a good discount and play $80 courses for 50 or 60. This group plays twice a week for 5+ months. 40 x $55 = $2200. These are nice courses, but not Pebble Beach. I pay about $1300 for a senior season pass at Snowbird that also includes an Ikon base pass good at dozens of major ski areas around the US.
 
Get a job teaching at pc
18 day commitment
Free pass for you and your wife
9 bucks to eat
40% off merch
Not bad
 
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