Steamboat, CO 12-27/28/30/31-08
- Thread starter EMSC
- Start date
I dunno. If you want any price breaks, don't ski destination resorts between December 26 and January 1. Many areas that do have fairly generous price breaks on multiday tickets (Mammoth being one example) black out those price breaks during the holiday period. I still stand by Steamboat as a lesser of evils for the holidays due to its snow record and lack of daytrippers. It does not surprise me at all that you have to pay for the privilege. Whistler is another example of a place with a great early record (this year may the worst in my records though) that jacks up the prices unmercifully for the holidays. And note who owns Steamboat now.
Yes I know about families and school breaks. 90+% of vacationing families would be far better off taking those family vacations during spring break than Christmas, particularly at most Colorado areas where prevailing conditions favor late season. During my family years I took 14 trips to destination resorts during school spring breaks and just 2 during Christmas-to-New-Year's zoo week. All but one of the spring breaks were better skiing than either of the Christmas weeks.
I also know that some northeastern states have week breaks in February. Any family that skis Christmas week and not the February break is particularly clueless IMHO.
Back in 2001 I wrote an Inside Tracks article on the subject: http://webpages.charter.net/tcrocker818/fam_ski.htm
With regard to very young children (< 5 years old) the bottom line is that you need an enthusiastic kid and need to be prepared to do the work yourself. I have occasionally offered advice here on this subject, but I now defer to JSpin as a the benchmark.
Yes I know about families and school breaks. 90+% of vacationing families would be far better off taking those family vacations during spring break than Christmas, particularly at most Colorado areas where prevailing conditions favor late season. During my family years I took 14 trips to destination resorts during school spring breaks and just 2 during Christmas-to-New-Year's zoo week. All but one of the spring breaks were better skiing than either of the Christmas weeks.
I also know that some northeastern states have week breaks in February. Any family that skis Christmas week and not the February break is particularly clueless IMHO.
Back in 2001 I wrote an Inside Tracks article on the subject: http://webpages.charter.net/tcrocker818/fam_ski.htm
With regard to very young children (< 5 years old) the bottom line is that you need an enthusiastic kid and need to be prepared to do the work yourself. I have occasionally offered advice here on this subject, but I now defer to JSpin as a the benchmark.
Tony Crocker":1ecgttp4 said:
In a nutshell ^^.
I understand why resorts like Steamboat that have developed such a strong brand can pull off this pricing model -- get the money while you can. But I'm curious how much return business this approach may kill off (EMSC) or how much bad word of mouth it creates. Steamboat isn't a super elite destination like Aspen, with a clientele so wealthy that it's protected from a miserable economy... how do they get away with it?
Steamboat does have that snow track record. Better to pay top $ for an area in full operation with good snow than 3/4 of top $ for restricted terrain or mediocre conditions at a less reliable place IMHO. My advice is consistent. If you want quality skiing for Christmas week do your homework, choose wisely and be prepared to pay. If you're price sensitive, find another time to take your ski vacations. That's what I did and I don't think I'm the most penny-pinching skier on FTO.
1) the very affluent, and
2) the hopelessly addicted.
As most here on FTO qualify for the second group, how many of US are likely to have reduced ski days in 2008-09 vs. our recent past history? I expected a reduction this year as I have slightly reduced vacation time and decided to bail on the most expensive prospective trip (another Extremely Canadian week). But we had better early snow than usual in both SoCal and Mammoth so I've already made up some of the projected shortfall.
History indicates that skier visits are much more sensitive to snow conditions than the economy. With most destination places in reasonable shape snow-wise, I don't see a big drop this year from last year's record 60M. I'd be quite surprised to see less than 55M. I think a very high proportion of skier visits are from two groups:
1) the very affluent, and
2) the hopelessly addicted.
As most here on FTO qualify for the second group, how many of US are likely to have reduced ski days in 2008-09 vs. our recent past history? I expected a reduction this year as I have slightly reduced vacation time and decided to bail on the most expensive prospective trip (another Extremely Canadian week). But we had better early snow than usual in both SoCal and Mammoth so I've already made up some of the projected shortfall.
Tony Crocker":2onhvjsw said:
Not realistic for most families IMO. Family vacations have to factor in a zillion variables. Price and snow are two of many.
I an not saying we are average, not saying we are not. But we are skiing some tough conditions this week with 60% of terrain open. For us...we are here because the incremental cost is zero and my wife wants to do christmas in the mountains.
Families are here and they seem to be having a lot of fun.
The demand is there. That's why the price is high.
Patrick
Well-known member
Harvey44":1oyd8fb6 said:
I agree with Tony's reasoning, however many (I don't include myself) don't have that many vacation-days in the year. Spring Break would require taking 5 work days off, less during the Holidays.
On a more or less related issue, I've taken 4 days off this Holiday to get December 25-January 4 vacation...however I haven't ski one day so far.
That makes all the difference in the world. My criticisms are directed at the people who pay the premium prices to ski Christmas week and then whine about how expensive it is.
Presumably that's due to the DL. Assuming the layoff is short term, I think Patrick's timing is lucky. He's sitting out the usually most unpleasant ski week of the season.
Patrick
Well-known member
Lucky? Only time will tell. I was hoping to take the extra time to surprise some of you, however I ran into so other issues that couldn't be resolved. I might have some time tomorrow to go shopping.Tony Crocker":30efggma said:
Planning on making some local turns on Sunday to get out of the house potentially with the kids (they went sliding today). I also want to test my back prior to our first Master's race on Wednesday. 8-[
edit: You are basically right on Holiday skiing. :wink: I've never tried hard to ski during the Holidays, maybe it was particularly due to trying to reconcile Holidays, take a breather and find time and energy to go skiing? :-k
EMSC
Well-known member
Point generally well taken and understood Tony. My parents did the bulk of the 'heavy lifting' on a 'once in a lifetime family event'. But even the big Summit county areas I know how to find some level of discounts on tickets even during the holiday period. But then those resorts actually have to compete daily, whereas Steamboat doesn't. They seem to take the destination trippers and say 'bleep' you, you're already here - pay up for the tickets or just don't ski.
Not that no one from my family will ever ski the 'boat again (wife & I each have 2 days left on our passes this year for example), but never during holiday weeks and I sure wouldn't recommend it to others from a cost perspective. Plus we had 4 school aged kids in the group - each with different spring breaks. I brought it up because that kind of business model isn't very good for repeat business and it was a topic of discussion all week.
I'm still cracking up over that pic of the barn taken from the gondola. I bet the marketing photographer has to be very precisely positioned to frame out all the newer resort-related buildings -- or just go straight to Photochop.
:lol:
:lol:
Yes, for the Denver daytrippers, which accounts for the excessive congestion. I fully understand why destination visitors might prefer someplace like Aspen or Steamboat that is not within daytrip range. Since the marketing people at the latter places know most of the visitors are there for a week, they are less likely to offer multiday discounts, except implicitly in a package that includes lodging.