ski-air travel stories

[ChrisC]

JetBlue does this type of boarding. Windows first, then Middle and Aisle last. Depending on the flight occupancy, the last aisle seats and basic economy always have to check bags.

For United - it will mean Aisle seats will get bad Group numbers and likely not be able to find space on full flights.

 

[jamesdeluxe]

JetBlue does this type of boarding.

The last time I flew Jetblue was ten months ago and I don't recall this boarding format. I was on a full flight from SLC using a low-status AA award and would've been subject to it. I suppose that one way to make it "fairer" would be to charge more for economy window seats.

 

[ChrisC]

The last time I flew Jetblue was ten months ago and I don't recall this boarding format. I was on a full flight from SLC using a low-status AA award and would've been subject to it. I suppose that one way to make it "fairer" would be to charge more for economy window seats.

I think it’s a more recent change, because I don’t remember it summer 2022. But unlike United, they did not publicize it - or allow it to get leaked.

However, here I am playing with my JetBlue boarding group pre-flight this October for a redeye to the East Coast. The AA & JetBlue partnership ended this summer, so goodbye upgrades/status.

Playing with seats before the flight. I didn’t want to risk a bag check, so picked window vs. my preferred aisle seat. (Just want to leave the airport after redeye).

Aisle = 11D = D Group
30 seconds later.....
Window = 11A = B Group

 

[jamesdeluxe]

Playing with seats before the flight. I didn’t want to risk a bag check, so picked window vs. my preferred aisle seat. (Just want to leave the airport after redeye).

Aisle = 11D = D Group
30 seconds later.....
Window = 11A = B Group

Hah, so that's how it works. I'm an aisle person too. Most people (non-FFs) wouldn't notice the group change, I bet.

I read that the Jetblue/Spirit merger discussions are restarting soon. I'm hoping it'll go through as Spirit has a decent presence at EWR that would ostensibly be handed over to Jetblue; however, a recent article said that Jetblue would give away a number of EWR gate slots (allegedly to Spirit lookalike Allegiant) as a bargaining chip to get government approval.

 

[ChrisC]

I read that the Jetblue/Spirit merger discussions are restarting soon. I'm hoping it'll go through as Spirit has a decent presence at EWR that would ostensibly be handed over to Jetblue; however, a recent article said that Jetblue would give away a number of EWR gate slots (allegedly to Spirit lookalike Allegiant) as a bargaining chip to get government approval.

JetBlue + Spirit will be interesting. I have no idea what the product offering will look like. Will they bring all Spirit aircraft and policies up to JetBlue levels? Yikes - it took years for AA to absorb USAir.

The more natural M&As would have been:

• JetBlue should have won the Virgin USA acquisition. Loved those Virgin flights! Order from the backseat screen whenever you want something, control movies/TV/etc/everything, so high tech and well-executed. Alaska Airlines killed it all. No more trace - except maybe they have Virgin's old gates and routes. But really, who from the East Coast wants to take 'Alaska' to LA or SF. Tough brand name hurdle.
• Spirit and Frontier are made for each other. Both horrific. I have witnessed people miss weddings because a single flight got canceled and nothing was available for days. And the fights at the gate and charges over carry-on bag size. Sad and tragic.

Strange in the government merger approval process they never mention the Ft. Lauderdale airport. JetBlue would control >>50% of air traffic: Spirit's HQ and a top 5 JetBlue hub. They will control 2 out of 4 terminals, and JetBlue is partially underwriting the construction of a new terminal 5.

 

[EMSC]

I'd rather have multiple choices than a mega-airport like Atlanta, Dallas, Charlotte, Philadelphia, or Denver

Denver is the odd one out in that group due to being a triple hub. Still have the mega logistics to deal with, but price-wise, United, Southwest and Frontier all have hubs and extensive networks which keep prices much lower than most mega airports with a single hub airline. Although United this summer decided to try their luck with super high pricing out of DIA so I have flown a whole bunch of other airlines this year for the first time in years (despite having hundreds of K of miles on United).

Orange County (SNA)

is my much preferred airport anytime I'm headed to anywhere in Southern California

Spirit and Frontier are made for each other. Both horrific.

+1

Understatement at best. Frontier used to be just enough more tolerable for ~2hr flights or so, but is now certainly no better than Spirit. I don't even pretend to understand the Jet Blue-Spirit merger concept. Either Jet Blue destroys its reputation going down to Spirit service, or if Spirit is upgraded to JetBlue style then all the cheap customers abandon the new combined airline since JetBlue is not a bottom barrel airline. Makes no sense at all.

 

[jamesdeluxe]

This article states that as travel bounces back after the pandemic (Delta and United have been posting record quarterly profits):
Spirit posted a net loss of $157.6 million, more than four times its loss a year ago., and forecast negative margins for the last three months of the year. CEO Ted Christie said in an earnings release “unfortunately, we have not seen the anticipated return to a normal demand and pricing environment for the peak holiday periods.”

 

[jamesdeluxe]

fights at the gate and charges over carry-on bag size.

I still remember in the mid-80s while on a layover at hideous Newark Terminal C -- before building the current terminal, which became Continental and now United -- an elderly Polish couple was fighting with People Express gate agents because they wanted to schlep their huge suitcase onto the plane as a carry-on instead of paying the $3 check-in fee ($8.42 adjusted for inflation). It's interesting to see how People Express was ahead of its time in charging for things that other airlines included. You could also walk on the flight with no ticket and pay onboard with a credit card!

 

[ChrisC]

Frontier used to be just enough more tolerable for ~2hr flights or so, but is now certainly no better than Spirit

I am still angry/annoyed/speechless when my Frontier plane caught fire in the early 2000s - an emergency landing in Cheyenne, Wyoming (Denver to Seattle).

However, the Frontier Flight Attendants could not get permission to use the emergency doors and slides. Corporate said it would cost almost $100k+ to put the emergency doors and slides away.

So we de-planed via one taxiway. As smoke wafted through the plane.

Too bad social media and smartphones did not exist.

 

[jnelly]

Knowing Frontier they’d probably charge you $15 to use the slide if they did deploy it.

 

[ChrisC]

Add-on I did not prepay for…..

 

[jamesdeluxe]

So this is how they're now offering award sales.

 

[EMSC]

Pretty pricy taxes and fees on that one to boot.

 

[jamesdeluxe]

Pretty pricy taxes and fees on that one to boot.

Seems dodgy as my taxes/fees on European nonstops are never more than $60-ish. Maybe it's specific to Frankfurt.

 

[ChrisC]

So this is how they're now offering award sales.

Seems a little ridiculous. An element of planning is involved in a trip to Europe from the USA where 12-18 hours of 'sale time' is not really enough.

Unless they want a lot of bookings and cancellations, United's FF award sales are not a very serious offering.

 

[jamesdeluxe]

United's FF award sales are not a very serious offering.

A joke. I had a long chat with a Newark-based flight attendant on the way back from Zurich; she told me that every trans-Atlantic flight she's been working over the past few months has been completely full. I guess that would be a good reason not to have a proper sale.

 

[EMSC]

I wonder if United has too few staff and planes to handle demand all of a sudden. In 2023 I took a shocking # of flights on other airlines because United was almost always by far the priciest (either $ or miles). I can only assume due to being fully booked all the time. I looked for some Florida flights for this year already and as an example AA wants only 40K miles for a one way flight (3 people), United wants 100K miles for the same day/time of day... Crazy.

It's a bit of an outlier, but for the AWS conference in Vegas this year (~65K conference goers) my United flight was already literally half+ full with pre-boarding and Gold (group 1) and above business travelers. It was crazy to see so many 1K, Global Service and above status holders boarding ahead of any formal boarding groups (normal for my flights might be ~5-10). That said, more than one of them screwed up for
seat upgrades since I was still in Premium Economy section on that flight despite only being Silver on United and many dozens of them having much higher status.

 

[jamesdeluxe]

I did a quick search for nonstop flights to ski gateways on United through the end of March and their shitty new award structure has stuck. These are the cheapest options:

• Zurich: 60K
• Geneva: 70K (but most itineraries are 80K)
• Milan: 70K (but most itineraries are 80K)

Oh well, the inexpensive awards were nice while they lasted all those years and one shouldn't argue with what's basically a free flight.

Meanwhile, AA continues to offer cheap overseas awards (45K); however, with inconvenient departure airports for me. To Milan through JFK and to Zurich through Philadelphia.

 

[Tony Crocker]

We are going on a Namibia tour in June with some extra time in Victoria Falls, Botswana and South Africa before and after. Cash fares from LAX are in the $1,800 range and naturally Delta wanted 166K miles. The good news is that with flexible dates on United I was able to get it for 95K miles plus fees around $140. Of course this deal was only offered with stops in both London and Frankfurt. At least the London outbound stop is ~10 hours during the day so we can get out and do something as we have done on some other trips, most recently Melbourne last May.

 

[Tony Crocker]

Oh well, the inexpensive awards were nice while they lasted all those years and one shouldn't argue with what's basically a free flight.

I'm going to say it's supply and demand, given the comments about how full the Euro flights are. That can be subject to change in the future.