Holiday Ski Plans, again!

[EMSC]

I do not recall an inquiry about Snowbasin.

Ditto. But also Dec 26-31 is by far the worst of the holiday crowding throughout all of north America IMO. At almost any resort anywhere. Better to ski on Christmas itself which I do most years including this year (for 2-3 hrs in the afternoon).

 

[Tony Crocker]

But also Dec 26-31 is by far the worst of the holiday crowding throughout all of north America IMO.

True, but if you go on those dates to an area only 30% open, that's extra masochistic.

 

[Sbooker]

True, but if you go on those dates to an area only 30% open, that's extra masochistic.

Add to that some fresh snow that hasn’t happen recently…….

 

[Sbooker]

I was just checking out the Jackson report. I had never seen the below feature.

 

[ChrisC]

Ditto. But also Dec 26-31 is by far the worst of the holiday crowding throughout all of north America IMO. At almost any resort anywhere. Better to ski on Christmas itself which I do most years including this year (for 2-3 hrs in the afternoon).

My brother's business can predict how busy Telluride will be by % of equipment out on the hill. Telluride's busiest day of the year is typically December 28th or 29th, depending on weather. People stop skiing by December 30 - so December 31st onwards is fine. Sometimes, things will pick up again on January 2nd, depending on the calendar.

Even Telluride can have 5-10 minute liftlines - sometimes 15 min at 1030am on popular/ski school lifts - during this period. After all, this is the one or two weeks a year those $ multimillion-dollar homes are used - that usually sit vacant except for a house sitter. I even saw Oprah and Gayle using their house - IG online photo.

Surprisingly, the next busiest dates are not President's Day/Week but Spring Break Weeks in March. Also, I don't know how he is allowed to do this, but he can go into the Telluride Lift Usage database and see if someone used a lift ticket or not/was out on the hill. Not sure if he is delivering/buying lift tickets, too, now. So many people want to be catered to/concierge service and will pay.

I'm still searching some databases/asking marketing folks to see how much they get reimbursed per Vail Epic Pass usage. I have a range, but I want a number.

 

[ChrisC]

I was just checking out the Jackson report. I had never seen the below feature.

It's called Jackson Hole BS/marketing hype. That number is from the summit Tram and does not relate well to the rest of the mountain. Even their Mid-Mountain is at the summit of Bridger Gondola about 2/3 the way up.

So if you subtract last night's snowfall, Jackson Hole was at 96-10=86. This is not remarkable for its peer group and likely behind Alta/Vail/Breck etc. Hence, only 50% of the mountain is open.

However, you should be getting dumped on and have a big terrain expansion!

 

[ChrisC]

For Gand Targhee, make sure you have a good lens for low-light conditions. I have had some vertigo on storm days there with new snow and fog. They often get low clouds/fog during storms and has the nickname "Grand Foghee"

I wish I had bought goggles with interchangeable lenses. Instead, I am up to 3-4 pairs for different light conditions and cart a few around on trips.

For low light/flat light conditions, you'll want goggle lenses with a yellow, amber, or light rose base. These lens colors offer the highest VLT, usually ranging from about 40-60%. This lighter tint allows as much light in as possible and provides you with enhanced contrast throughout those darker days

Oakley's Models - this is what I own since it fits best with my helmet.

Looks like you will have some fun times....Access Road can be a bit challenging.

Some great powder areas have a low expert/high intermediate grade (yellow). Blackfoot lift is good, too. I have not skied the new Peaked Mountain lift. It's a really fun powder mountain where you cannot get into trouble.

 

[EMSC]

I wish I had bought goggles with interchangeable lenses. Instead, I am up to 3-4 pairs for different light conditions and cart a few around on trips.

For low light/flat light conditions, you'll want goggle lenses with a yellow, amber, or light rose base. These lens colors offer the highest VLT, usually ranging from about 40-60%. This lighter tint allows as much light in as possible and provides you with enhanced contrast throughout those darker days

Oakley's Models - this is what I own since it fits best with my helmet.

Ugh, no thanks on having/carrying around multiple goggles.

I've been using Zeal Optics for a few years now (they are HQ in Boulder). Best part of that group is their goggles that are both Polarized and photochromatic (eg they auto-adjust to the amount of sunlight). They have 3 different colored lenses that auto change from ~15% to 35% VLT which covers the vast majority of ski days - especially in Colo. For those couple of dark days per year (will take to Mustang for sure for example), I also have an interchangeable lens that is a blue coloration at 62% VLT and quite incredible in super dark snow storms IMHO. Worst part of their system is that the anti-fog coating on the inner surface is crazy sensitive to being touched by ANYthing (eg even snow getting in if you crash or even lift your goggles on your snowy helmet will leave spots that can never be fixed/cleaned, or etc... without ruining the anti-fog.

 

[Tony Crocker]

It's called Jackson Hole BS/marketing hype. That number is from the summit Tram and does not relate well to the rest of the mountain. Even their Mid-Mountain is at the summit of Bridger Gondola about 2/3 the way up.

The "marketing hype" number is from just above the top of the Bridger gondola. Measurements were first taken there in 1998, the year after Bridger gondola was built. The mid-mountain site really is at mid-mountain elevation 8,180 and dates back to at least 1968. But if you look at actual ski terrain there is probably 3x as much below 8,180 as above (Hobacks, Apres Vous, etc.).

There are 4 measuring sites at Jackson and you can look up their history here. Organization is not by site but by month. Put in a month and you get all 4 sites for that month going back to 1974-75. Data is complete Nov.-Apr. since 1998-99.
The base at 6,510 feet averages 141.78 inches
Mid-mountain 8,180 feet averages 364.66 inches, essentially the same as the 369 I use for that site since 1971.
Raymer 9,360 feet is the site above the Bridger gondola and averages 456.49 inches
There is a site in Rendezvous Bowl 9,580 which averages 433.07 inches but it is more wind exposed and erratic.

Ironically, Jackson's record snowfall season mid-mountain was 572 inches in 1996-97, the year before Raymer opened. Raymer has exceeded that number only in 2008 but was probably over 700 inches in 1996-97.

Season-to-date numbers on Jackson's website are also since Oct. 1 and and the Raymer number is what's always in that graph and any press releases. But I give JHMR management credit. At least they publish the numbers by Oct. 31 and also include the mid-mountain so I can use a Nov. 1 start at mid-mountain for realistic comparisons to other ski areas.

By contrast Park City only publishes top of Jupiter Bowl in-season so I use 80% of that and get the more representative numbers from Summit House at the end of the season. I also don't get mid-mountain Alyeska until end of the season. Alyeska currently reports 207 inches snowfall at top of lift service, but it also reports being 30% open on a 18-68 inch base, which tells me there has been a lot of rain lower down.

I still believe it would be unwise for sbooker and family to go to Jackson this week. The lift system there does not handle crowds well and I think they will find the powder less competitive and more in their comfort zone at Targhee. And how fast Jackson gets more than 50% open with ongoing storms and extensive control work remains to be seen (this applies to AltaBird too). ChrisC is right about the goggles at "Grand Foghee."

 

[ChrisC]

There are 4 measuring sites at Jackson and you can look up their history here. Organization is not by site but by month. Put in a month and you get all 4 sites for that month going back to 1974-75. Data is complete Nov.-Apr. since 1998-99.
The base at 6,510 feet averages 141.78 inches
Mid-mountain 8,180 feet averages 364.66 inches, essentially the same as the 369 I use for that site since 1971.
Raymer 9,360 feet is the site above the Bridger gondola and averages 456.49 inches
There is a site in Rendezvous Bowl 9,580 which averages 433.07 inches but it is more wind exposed and erratic.

So Raymer might be around here?

 

[ChrisC]

I've been using Zeal Optics for a few years now (they are HQ in Boulder)

I own a pair of Zeal goggles. Before my Alaska trip in April 2015, I purchased 50% clearance video goggles. I do not own a Go-Pro. So when I want to record skiing footage, I use the Zeal Goggles. They work well - click a button on the side, and you are ready. Unfortunately, Zeal no longer produces recording goggles - nor does it support the app anymore. But easy to download files and edit. I generally only use this pair on special days, and I will switch these goggles out if I'm done recording for the day.

I'm a bit of a mess with the goggle situation. My Euro friends were like WTF is going on with you? I just stated I bought a pair, then another....and so on.

But I am a bit of a gear whore. I buy, I sell on eBay. I think I have optimized a system, then something better comes along.

 

[Sbooker]

I’ve had a snowy but uneventful drive to Idaho but saw a lot of cars and trucks off the side of the road on the i15. Guy at the ski shop in Driggs says to leave the hotel no later than 7.30am to get a park on a holiday or weekend.

For Gand Targhee, make sure you have a good lens for low-light conditions. I have had some vertigo on storm days there with new snow and fog. They often get low clouds/fog during storms and has the nickname "Grand Foghee"

I wish I had bought goggles with interchangeable lenses. Instead, I am up to 3-4 pairs for different light conditions and cart a few around on trips.

For low light/flat light conditions, you'll want goggle lenses with a yellow, amber, or light rose base. These lens colors offer the highest VLT, usually ranging from about 40-60%. This lighter tint allows as much light in as possible and provides you with enhanced contrast throughout those darker days

Oakley's Models - this is what I own since it fits best with my helmet.
View attachment 43417


Looks like you will have some fun times....Access Road can be a bit challenging.


View attachment 43418

Some great powder areas have a low expert/high intermediate grade (yellow). Blackfoot lift is good, too. I have not skied the new Peaked Mountain lift. It's a really fun powder mountain where you cannot get into trouble.

View attachment 43419

Thanks. I have driven up the hill to Grand Targhee once before but in less snowy conditions.

 

[ChrisC]

I still believe it would be unwise for sbooker and family to go to Jackson this week. The lift system there does not handle crowds well and I think they will find the powder less competitive and more in their comfort zone at Targhee. And how fast Jackson gets more than 50% open with ongoing storms and extensive control work remains to be seen (this applies to AltaBird too)

I agree. There are fewer crowds at Targhee. It has A LOT of broad open terrain (that is open). It is fun. The terrain is sweet for low expert/high intermediate. Also, since it has so much open terrain, you will ACTUALLY ski powder for most of the day. Targhee does not need a ton of snow since its terrain is less steep and has more of a grassy base and fewer rocks.

What will happen at Jackson to you: Liftlines! The groomed/open trails will be skied out by 11 am. Then, you can choose steeper/tighter trees - with barely adequate coverage. And hit a bunch of stuff underneath - expect some ski base damage. Or skiing lumpy variable cutup powder on open terrain/trails. And who knows how much terrain they can open safely.

Of course visit Jackson Hole, but spend most of your time at Grand Targhee.

 

[tseeb]

Of course visit Jackson Hole, but spend most of your time at Grand Targhee.

And eat Thai food in Driggs (Teton Thai, but there used to be another one, amazing in such a small town) and go to Grand Teton brewery in Victor if it works into your schedule. There used to be a great breakfast place in a historic building on highway going through Driggs Victor, but I don't see it on tripadvisor or google maps.

 

[Sbooker]

And eat Thai food in Driggs (Teton Thai, but there used to be another one, amazing in such a small town) and go to Grand Teton brewery in Victor if it works into your schedule. There used to be a great breakfast place in a historic building in Driggs, but I don't see it on tripadvisor or google maps.

Had the Thai tonight. Was fantastic. Kylie had a chicken dish with fennel that was mind blowing.
Had a Teton Brewing beer with dinner but will try to get to the venue.

 

[ChrisC]

I was looking at the Jackson webcams - a great resource for liftlines since they show the base of every chairlift. For December 28th on powder Saturday, everything is surprisingly great. Most lifts are ski on practically, the Bridger is minor, and the Tram is only a 2-car or so wait.

Bumping up the terrain trail counts nicely, too!

Mornings can still be bad at Jackson since the locals will come out for a few hours and leave by noon - I know that's what happens at Telluride. I will look tomorrow.

Oops lunch time is over.....Tram might be a 4-car wait.

 

[Sbooker]

No waiting longer than a minute here over the hill either.

 

[snowave]

thats not bad at all for Jackson.

Targhee is very light.... although, it's also after 2... but still. I suspect visibility is also a factor.

Tamarack, ID yesterday was ~ 20 minutes. Haven't heard how long Brundage lines were, but I suspect less thanks to the new HSQ, which now gives 2 fast ways to get to the top from the base area.

 

[Tony Crocker]

Powderchaser Steve is in Jackson this week. He reports that crowds were not bad; tram peaked at maybe 2 bucket wait. Lower Sublette and Colter opened yesterday and patrol says the Hobaclks will open Tuesday.

The Tetons are looking at another 18+ inches over the next two days. Sbooker and family will score at either mountain.

 

[Sbooker]

We went to Jackson today.