Mt. Waterman and Snowcrest/Kratka Ridge

I highly doubt the north face runs of waterman have bare spots... what Tom may be talking about is getting to chair Two and back to the lodge. Getting to the main face needs cat work as well.

Those runs get major sun and melt out fast since they DO NOT face north!

This was a test run for MW... get it opened and learn a thing or two and then get ready for next season. hmmm and add MT Biking this summer I hope.

Tom tell Newcomb I say hello from Mammoth...
 
Tom, please keep posting on Mount Waterman operations.I am sad to hear that they might be done for the season.I was also waiting for Baldy to melt out and then shift it over to Waterman to close out the local season.But I do understand that they need to make money.I wish them the best.
 
Mt. Waterman will not operate this weekend, March 22 and 23, due to lack of staffing for the lifts. The owners are looking to hire someone with significant expertise in lift operations and grooming, and will not be able to operate until such hiring takes place.

They hold out some hope that they will be able to operate the weekend of March 29 and 30th. However, that will depend both on success in hiring additional lift operations personnel, and snow conditions.



We'll keep you posted on the situation.
 
Ahem: It's easy Posts merged, as I've done before for this thread a couple of times.

SoCal Rider is correct. Let's keep postings regarding Mt. Waterman official announcements and the general saga about its reopening in this thread.

Only trip reports describing the conditions/experience on a specific day at Mt. Waterman should be in separate threads.
 
Howdy,

Mt. Waterman's status now at the end of the season seems a little murky right now. Will the lifts be running on Easter Sunday? (tomorrow) I'd like to hit the lifts Sunday morning if it's open. Thanks,
 
No! Waterman is done for the season.

The new owners were able to see what the ski business is all about and will now move into the summer months with an idea of what needs to get done. A lot more money needs to be spent and this season definatly didn't produce any revenues to be re-invested. So we will see how things progress from here.
 
Tom,

Suck! Bad news, man. Thanks for your effort in getting the word out this season, hugely appreciate it.

Given the ultra-late start Waterman got on the season, even just breaking even, shoot, even just opening at all is a huge coup IMHO. SoCal wrote Waterman off for dead, and it came back for a few weekends with great snow, good times, and icy cold beers. Plenty to build on for the future. I only hit Waterman once this season, but it was a great day of riding, and it was pure stoke on the faces of all 300+ riders and skiers on that day.

Next season- a little snow, a little advertising, a few newspaper articles here and there, a little internet word-of-mouth, and Waterman is looking good. I've never before witnessed a dead ski area rise from the grave, and the Snow Gods have surely smiled on everyone's effort in making it happen this season.

Long live Mt. Waterman. See you on opening day '08-'09.
 
I wish them luck, but considering how quiet Baldy was yesterday, it's going to be an uphill battle. Presumably this season has convinced the new owners not to even think about messing with Kratka Ridge until Mt. Waterman is securely reestablished.

I did have curiosity about the reopening of Waterman. Yet on the 3 available weekends I still chose to go to Baldy, and from what I've read I'm quite sure I made the right choice each time.
 
I do have 13 days lifetime on Mt. Waterman, so I am far from ignorant about what it has to offer.

I will admit part of my decisions are based on my "bigger is better" bias. I'd rather ski 12 or 15 different interesting runs on Baldy than spend most of the day on 3 or 4 of comparable quality at Waterman.

Mt. Waterman, particularly in startup mode, has the potential to be much better on powder days due to lack of crowds. But they will need to get the road open while the powder is still good.

And I've said here before that the spring skiing in big years can be better because Baldy's sunny exposures burn off while nearly everything at Waterman faces north. But it must not have worked that way this year (can be altitude related when there are mixed precip events) since Mt. Waterman closed March 15.

I try to explain my reasoning of when and where I ski. Others may have different priorities and reach different conclusions.
 
Burn off has nothing to do with closing. It could still be open with great spring skiing as always. Closing is purely financial. I hiked Kratka the other day and it has great coverage. I have always felt Kratka with its compactness and roadside facilities would be the better choice to put in snowmaking and lights for night skiing.
 
First of all I am thankful for Rick and the guys for saving Mt. waterman. With that said,
it will be hard to get the word out and to get new people up to the mountain if they do not keep it open. Even if it means running on days that they don't think they will make money. I was up on a day this year on one of those days they decided not to open and in the few minutes I was there watching it drizzle I watched probably 25 people pull up get out of there cars and then leave. There was no one around at all, not even say sorry but come back again. A lot of those people had there mountain high season passes on. They missed a great opportunity to hand out flyers and maybe $10 off coupons.

I hope that their money problems aren't serious. If so maybe it's time to think about a co-op. I have been skiing Waterman since 1979 and have hundreds of days there. Many of those days were with only ten cars in the lot. I know times are different, and you need to sell 70+ tickets to break even, but it must be hard to keep a crew if you don't keep them working. I know that theses guys have real jobs so I think they really need to get someone like you Tom who can be there every day and run it like you did back in the day.

Thanks for all the good info. I've been trying for a long time to be able to post.
 
This Saturday we will be taking the mountain down -Sadly removing tower pads and putting away equipment for next season. It has been a remarkable season of rebirth with opportunities to work with friends. It also was filled with the disappointment in too few days.
I do believe that the new owners learned much this year. Preparation and planning is so important. An experienced and trained staff is critical for the public to be able to safely enjoy themselves.
Until next season. Thank you all for your support.
Mike
 
Hey Mike!

I hope you guys stop by the Ranch after for a beer. It was great to see all you Patrollers again. Hopefully better and longer next year. I'm thinking about enrolling in the EMT program out here in Palmdale so that maybe I can fill that weekday Patrol Director position for next year.
 
I was so happy to see Mt waterman back from the grave.It is by far my favorite So Cal ski area. It has been frustrating to see and hear how poorly the area has been run.The lack of updating on the web site and snow phone is laughable. On March 9th,I had brought some freinds up, who had never skied there before. We loaded the lift at 9:00 and sat around till 11:00, when chair 2 started up.All the face runs were closed. It would of been nice to know this before purchasing a ticket.We were informed by the ski patrol that any run to the parking lot were unlikely to open.I rode the chair down and got vouchers for another day, which will not happen this season.By closing on marginal or less than perfect days, people will not even chance the fact that the place is opened or closed.They were even closed the !6th when there was a fresh dusting.
Were the new owners expecting to make money right out of the box? Even with an excelent product and service,it take time to build up the customer base.I tuly hope they get a new game plan going.Say what you like about Lynn Newcomb,but Waterman was open no matter how rough the it was around the edges.
 
Useful feedback IMHO. If it saves money to be open only 3-4 days a week I think that's OK, but there needs to be a full professional effort to have as much skiing as possible available when the area is open. Waterman skiers as at Baldy will tolerate a wide range of snow conditions on the terrain they like. Having people show up and find an area closed or much more limited than advertised is deadly for the word of mouth marketing that Mt. Waterman needs to succeed.
 
Last Saturday a number of us removed the safety equipment and stored it for next season. This was done with a great deal of sadness because of the short time we were open. The other feeling was that we really were glad that we had the opportunity to even be there after 5 years.
There is certainly a great deal of good snow on the mountain but the trails to and from lift 2 and 3 are gone. The bottom of lift 1 is a mess with a mixture of snow and sand. The snow at the loading and unloading zones are also gone along with the snow in front of the Warming Hut.
It was a baptism of fire and snow for a team of new owners facing some unusual events (Rt 2 closed with a foot of ice for almost two weeks). I agree with Tony that the web site must be kept accurate along with the snow phone and, when there is snow, the mountain should be open. I believe lessons have been learned.
In 15 years of patrolling at Waterman and elsewhere, I have a great deal of admiration for those who take on the task of owning and running a ski resort. An alpine area with a desert on one side and the Pacific Ocean on the other, poor placement. How do you staff, plan, and market when your season depends on Mother Nature and not science to produce your snow.
I hope that the owners have the opportunity to make Waterman the mountain it can be. I know they love the place just like we do. They have placed their money where our heart are. I would suggest that all those interested in Waterman to share your thoughts with the Metcalfs.
Thanks for letting us serve you. Mike
 
Very well said Mike!

I know a letter was received from the Forest Service about possibly not being open long enough that was obviously in response to complaints from members of the public who are probably the ones posting negatively on this forum. It is so easy for us to sit here on our computers and voice an opinion on what should or should not be done when it is not our money. The mountain needs a lot more money put into it to get it ready for what will hopefully be a full season of snow next year. Rick now knows what it takes to run a ski area and will be the first to admit mistakes were made. He will learn from those mistakes and make next year bigger and better and I for one support his decisions 100%. If anyone out there is interested in investing some cash I'm sure he would love to talk to you.
 
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