TR Crested Butte, Telluride

[coldsmoke]

Probably 1 day for just groomers. However, they are installing 2 new chairs for this season that will serve "some of the best intermediate (BLUE RUNS) terrain in Montana!"

That quote is pure marketing.

Well, yeah, that is why it is in quotes. I'm not that familiar with the new terrain but if memory serves it is to the north and not very steep.

I like Bridger personally, but for topography it's one of the worst I've seen anywhere for GPaul's tastes. If he's going to Big Sky anyway, I can see the one day there to "add it to the list." At Big Sky Andesite and Thunder Wolf are the only groomed areas with decent pitch. That's a relatively small fraction of a large ski complex.

Andesite has kept a many a tourist happy for a week, it only needs to keep GPaul happy for a few days. Skiing is only part of the overall vacation for lots of folks. I don't think GPaul is skiing bell to bell and tracking vert. But maybe he is.

I understand as much as anyone the desire to see new places, but now you have scheduled 6 days at Bridger/Big Sky vs. 3 at Jackson/Targhee, both of which have more consistent pitch than Big Sky. I would recommend reversing that allocation.

Not sure if GPaul only likes the corduroy, but Targhee could get quite frustrating for him if he hits a storm cycle. I've been there many a powder day when very little is groomed. Big Sky usually grooms Andesite nightly.

 

[Tony Crocker]

My groomer comments are based upon GPaul saying he didn't like Snowmass, which most intermediates love. He'll like Casper and Apres Vous at Jackson quite a bit I predict.

Yes, if he hits a storm cycle at Targhee he should rent some fat skis and take a lesson. It might open some new horizons.

I'm not saying don't go to Big Sky. I'm saying adjust the balance among areas a bit in the direction of those areas he might like more, which include some of those in Utah like Snowbasin also.

 

[Admin]

I'm saying adjust the balance among areas a bit in the direction of those areas he might like more, which include some of those in Utah like Snowbasin also.

Best in Utah for LSGs, IMO.

 

[jamesdeluxe]

Now that a number of people have spent time providing thoughtful comments on Gpaul's itinerary, I think that the moment has come for him to cancel the trip. :-D

 

[socal]

Now that a number of people have spent time providing thoughtful comments on Gpaul's itinerary, I think that the moment has come for him to cancel the trip. :-D

Or change destination to Tahoe.

 

[Tony Crocker]

Now that a number of people have spent time providing thoughtful comments on Gpaul's itinerary, I think that the moment has come for him to cancel the trip. :-D

That's only when he schedules a trip to the East. :stir:

Western trips he just sticks with his original plan and ignores all our comments.

 

[gpaulski]

I understand as much as anyone the desire to see new places, but now you have scheduled 6 days at Bridger/Big Sky vs. 3 at Jackson/Targhee, both of which have more consistent pitch than Big Sky. I would recommend reversing that allocation. I recommend that you do the Old Faithful excursion from West Yellowstone as opposed to Jackson. The logical time to do that is on your departure day from Big Sky, as Liz and I did last March. It will break up your drive; spend that night in Driggs and ski Targhee the next day or two before moving on to Jackson.

I don't understand the bus inquiry about Bozeman since you're obviously doing this trip with a car. Just not wanting to drive back n forth.

Tony, excellent advice. Was planning the ystone part precisely as you did.

I think I'm owed some recognition as maybe "the most bashed member", :dead horse:

POWDER skiing, any simple, real simple advice to try this time around??

Best!

 

[jimk]

I think I'm owed some recognition as maybe "the most bashed member", :dead horse:

Best!

I'll give you a big shout-out for repeatedly and doggedly traveling long distances from warm climates to ski each winter and bringing family too. I've enjoyed many vicarious ski trips through your internet queries \/

 

[Marc_C]

I think I'm owed some recognition as maybe "the most bashed member",

Why do you think that is the case? Could it have something to do with asking for trip advice (more than once) and then basically ignoring all the advice and doing what you originally planned?

POWDER skiing, any simple, real simple advice to try this time around??

Simple: if there is a powder day where you are skiing, rent fat powder skis and take a lesson.

 

[Admin]

POWDER skiing, any simple, real simple advice to try this time around??

Simple: if there is a powder day where you are skiing, rent fat powder skis and take a lesson.

Agreed. FYI if it snows while you're in Utah, Alta offers a highly-regarded off-trail workshop that will focus on powder that day because, well...there's powder to be had:
http://alta.com/pages/adultadvanced.php

 

[Tony Crocker]

Why do you think that is the case? Could it have something to do with asking for trip advice (more than once) and then basically ignoring all the advice and doing what you originally planned?

And also asking for further advice once the trips were imminent (both Tahoe and Colorado) with known weather/snow conditions problems and continuing to ignore the advice.

Simple: if there is a powder day where you are skiing, rent fat powder skis and take a lesson.

+10 Particularly look for this at Targhee, where the environment is less competitive than at Alta and terrain is consistently at a more intermediate level. And for a new powder skier, you should be going to someplace less competitive like Solitude, Snowbasin or Powder Mt. on a Utah powder day if storm totals are similar. The reality is that often they are not. When Alta has significantly more new snow than the other places, you should follow admin's advice about taking powder lessons there. You'll have almost no chance of learning powder at Alta without instructors getting you off the beaten path to the most appropriate places for you.

 

[gpaulski]

My apologies for not heeding some of your advice, but what the heck, ain't the end of the world. And, I'll give you a big shout-out for repeatedly and doggedly traveling long distances from warm climates to ski each winter and bringing family too. I've enjoyed many vicarious ski trips through your internet queries \/ TKS jmc!


Actually did take 1 class many moons ago, just never got the hang of it. No fat skis back then, is this absolutely necessary??

 

[jamesdeluxe]

Given that Gpaul manages to get lots of people to put on their thinking caps and give their opinions every year (even though it may turn out to be a purely intellectual exercise #-o), he should be considered a valued FTO member.

If you're that annoyed by his crimes against humanity, don't respond.

 

[Tony Crocker]

No fat skis back then, is this absolutely necessary??

Yes it is, and if you ignore this advice you'll get no sympathy here and perhaps some resentment from the other people in your class that you will be slowing down. In 2006 in New Zealand I was in a heliski group where this guy from Ohio didn't think he needed to rent fat skis but was soon floundering. The guide parked him on a glacier and made him sit out 3 of our 8 runs. Not the way most people would want to spend ~$600.

On a more constructive note, you should think about renting full time on your western trips a ski with tip rocker and 90+mm width underfoot. Ski technology has evolved to the point that you can rip your LSG's to your heart's content on those skis, yet they will also make life far easier on you in a wide range of ungroomed snow conditions. And I expect the Utards will chime in, "No, you should really go over 100mm underfoot!" This does not change the advice to rent a wide soft ski with both tip and tail rocker for your powder lesson or any snowy day with say 6+ inches new.

If you're that annoyed by his crimes against humanity, don't respond.

I think these threads are quite educational for the "lurkers" that most of these forums have. They can draw their own conclusions vs. those who heed the advice like johnnash in 2012.

 

[Admin]

Why do you think that is the case? Could it have something to do with asking for trip advice (more than once) and then basically ignoring all the advice and doing what you originally planned?

And also asking for further advice once the trips were imminent (both Tahoe and Colorado) with known weather/snow conditions problems and continuing to ignore the advice.

Simple: if there is a powder day where you are skiing, rent fat powder skis and take a lesson.

+10 Particularly look for this at Targhee, where the environment is less competitive than at Alta and terrain is consistently at a more intermediate level. And for a new powder skier, you should be going to someplace less competitive like Solitude, Snowbasin or Powder Mt. on a Utah powder day if storm totals are similar. The reality is that often they are not. When Alta has significantly more new snow than the other places, you should follow admin's advice about taking powder lessons there. You'll have almost no chance of learning powder at Alta without instructors getting you off the beaten path to the most appropriate places for you.

Keep in mind that when contemplating a powder lesson there's more at stake than just where to find the most powder. There's also the quality of the instruction, which is higher at Alta than just about anywhere. The Alf Engen Ski School had the reputation that it does for a reason.


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[Tony Crocker]

I have no doubt of the quality of Alta's instruction. Nonetheless powder is far easier to learn where it's untracked than chewed up. The ideal might be to get that lesson at Alta, then go off to Powder Mt. the next day and apply what you have learned. However, when it comes to powder you take what the weather brings you and it rarely conforms to idealized timing visualized in advance.

 

[socal]

Actually did take 1 class many moons ago, just never got the hang of it. No fat skis back then, is this absolutely necessary??

Like Tony said, yes it is. Fat skis help but in my opinion a little bit of tip/tail rocker is really the difference maker. It's night and day and you'll just have a MUCH more enjoyable day if there's powder and/or chopped up powder. Also, don't be afraid of a 90-100+ mm underfoot ski on the groomers. I can "carve" all day on my 105mm Gotama's with tip/tail rocker just as easy as my old Volkl AC4s (which i haven't taken out of the closet in 3 seasons). Honestly, I can and do have a ton of fun on groomers on my 130mm underfoot Kuro's. Ski technology has really changed over the years.

 

[Admin]

Ditto. My Super 7s (115mm underfoot) are my daily driver.

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[Tony Crocker]

My daily driver Bonafides are 98mm underfoot.

Fat skis help but in my opinion a little bit of tip/tail rocker is really the difference maker.

Tip rocker works nearly everywhere. Tail rocker is a key assist in powder but more difficult to hold a carve on the groomed. That why you'll still want to rent a different ski for a powder intensive day. For those of us who paid our dues on the powder learning curve a Gotama or Bonafide works just fine on most resort powder days. For someone inexperienced in powder you want as much tip and tail rocker as you can get.

 

[Admin]

Tip rocker works nearly everywhere. Tail rocker is a key assist in powder but more difficult to hold a carve on the groomed.

Tip/tail rocker has zero effect on the ability to hold a carved turn on groomed snow, so long as the ski still has conventional camber underfoot. That just makes the ski behave like a shorter ski than it is, which is why I always advocate going longer than you think you'll need on a ski with early rise. It's reverse camber that's difficult to ski on groomed, and very few current skis are a true reverse camber design anymore.